33 replies to this topic

[toltec]

I have just finished my 8 weeks cycle of just 500mg of Sus. The cycle was great, put on 20lbs and increased size and strength adequately. I am going to take at least 3 months off, taking no AAS.

I have a few questions:

What would be some suggestions for my 2nd cycle, and when would be a good time to start thinking about it?

Should I take any supplements e.g. Nitric Oxide or Plasma Jet while on my off cycle? Any recommendations?

I did not do any cardio during this cycle as I just wanted to bulk up. Now I am wanting to add cardio and perhaps cut a bit of fat. Thoughts? I do not want to lose weight and muscle, I would like to loss some body fat. Thoughts?


I am very much getting into my routine and loving the work outs and my cycle was great. I want to only proceed to bigger and better things. Any advice will be very much appreciated. Love this forum, you guys have been awesome!


T

[Darkhrse99]

20lbs in 8 weeks is pretty good. I'm on week 4 and haven't gain a lbs yet.

[toltec]

It was primarily muscle too. I am impressed with the results. It has been hard work. I am a hard gainer and the key is just like everyone says on here, eat, eat, eat. I tried fairly hard to eat as much as possible, and I feel I did fair, but definitely not as well as I could have. I was relentless in the gym and got plenty of sleep. I am now 6'5 216, and would like to get up to 235, with low body fat. I am an outdoor mountain guide so I can't lug around huge mass. I want lean strength.

[piotr]

20lb is pretty good considering much of the testosterone in the sust. wouldnt have really kicked in until week 4... i'd suggest that if you had ran it 12 weeks or a little longer you would have had the maximum benefit out of that particular injectible...

keeping that in mind i dont think you have to think too much about the next cycle... considering the excellent results you had with only 8 weeks of sust. i would suggest that for the 2nd cycle just up the dosage of the sust. and run it a bit longer...

no more than 750mg sust / week for 12-14 weeks... you could do an amp every monday, wednesday, and friday... that would also keep your plasma levels of testosterone essentially perfectly stable and peaked given the half life of the shortest ester (propionate) in there is 4.5 days...

of course at 750mg per week of test you have to consider estrogen issues and plan accordingly... a little bit of arimidex should go a long way, especially as from what you said you want to minimize bloat and keep as lean as is reasonably possible...

then for your third course you can think about throwing in something else and perhaps dropping the test dosage a tad...

i really think 750mg/week test is the max you would need for 2nd cycle...

piotr

[PERSIANBOLIC]

Thats great progress brotha, keep up the good work. Since your a hard gainer the most important thing you can do is maintain your appetite, like you were on AS. You could also take some creatine.
As far as next cycle, I would keep it simple like pitor said. I would keep the test the same and add some dbol, it will help you with bulking.

1-10 Test 500mg
1-4 Dbol 25mg

[MissKBuff]

Nice! Sounds like it worked out well for ya!

[NO LIMITS]

Damn 20 lbs in 8 weeks. I'm jealous. Hardgainer????? I have always been a fan of not upping the dose until needed. If you gained 20 lbs off 500mg/wk then I would stick wiht that just run like they said for 12 - 14 weeks. Don't get discouraged by any losses after cycle because when bulkiing especially if you add d-bol you might have the tendacy to hold alot of water. I do. This will come back off after cycle so it could give you a false since of gaining while on. You can always take a small dose of a duiretic while on during bulking to control water retension. I have used winny for this also. Great job on cycle though, Wish I could gain 20lbs in 8 weeks. Damn that's alot. Hard to hide that bro.

[kb91notch347]

I have always been a fan of not upping the dose until needed. If you gained 20 lbs off 500mg/wk then I would stick wiht that just run like they said for 12 - 14 weeks.

I absolutely agree with this. Keep it simple...

KB

[toltec]

Appreciate the advice. Yeah, I busted my ass and took a lot of words to heart on the board. I am definitely a firm believer in eating like a horse, that's the key, the AAS is more like a catalyst when you are doing the right things; rest, routine, and eating heavy portions.

Eating heavy was the hardest part for me. I was drinking 3 On whey shakes a day, and would definitely switch to Caesin protein in the morning to avoid feeling so full throughout the morning and mid day. It was hard for me to get my going in the morning. I have a lot of moose meat in the freezer, so I would cook up 2lbs of moose meat every other night and would eat a lot in the evening. I learned a lot for this cycle and will use it to better the next cycle.


What I was wondering is if doing cardio will eat up some of my gains, is it possible to concentrate more on the bit of excess fat while not decreasing the muscle very much?

I am a mountain guide and have to train hard with heavy packs and long range cardio. Any thoughts?

[NO LIMITS]

Cardio is not gonna just make you loose the muscle you gain but of the 20lbs I seriously dought that is all muscle. I would say be thankful if you gain 20lbs and can maintain and keep 12 lbs of solid muscle. This is why alot of people get so discouraged after getting off becasue they gain so much while on their cycles the arenot prepared for what they will drop to after off. You will never be as jacked as you are while on. If so why take it. You being a mountain guide you are already use to intense cardio with all the packing. Just keep the eating up with clean foods and you should be alright.

[toltec]

Yeah, I realize all the facts that surround the initial gain loss. It certainly won't discourage me. I am looking at this at a long term project. The continuing diet will be key. The 20lbs wasn't 100% muscle, yet I am very surprised at the visible muscle gained.

[piotr]

Thats great progress brotha, keep up the good work. Since your a hard gainer the most important thing you can do is maintain your appetite, like you were on AS. You could also take some creatine.
As far as next cycle, I would keep it simple like pitor said. I would keep the test the same and add some dbol, it will help you with bulking.

1-10 Test 500mg
1-4 Dbol 25mg

You know what, I'd go with what PERSIANBOLIC laid out in hindsight... if you gained 20lb on 8 weeks 500mg test then you probably don't need to up the dosage at all... throwing in that dbol at the start will give you a few extra pounds on top... simple and effective... i'd still run it for 12 weeks though...

piotr

[Darkhrse99]

How much protein,carbs and fats did you take in a day?

[~R~F~G~]

Imagine how you'd be if you put 100% into your diet. Planning your cycle and cycling your plan is important. But eating the proper ammount of calories and the right kind of calories is equally as important. 8 weeks was short. And like the rest said keep the second one simple too. 12 weeks with maybe Dbol or Tbol depending on your goals.

Working out and sleeping is the easiest part of this.. Eating correctly is where the work is. Someone once wrote,

"There is no such thing as a hard gainer, just someone that dont know how to eat".

I'm not saying this directly as a knoock in your ability to eat. But if you ate the way you did before you ran a cycle you may have been heavier from the start. Alot of people only get serious about pounding down food while they are on. You need to eat that way no matter what your taking.

For now keep up with CEE. and get some Avina Sativa.

Congrats on the gains.

[toltec]

Completely agree with the facts on eating being the most important part of the equation. There's absolutely no doubt about it.