20 replies to this topic

[BD_554]

I was browsing through the new topics and didn't notice some common themes on other boards. The primary topic I see missing is discussions around peptides. I was wondering who here is using them or familiar with them. I have been dabbling a bit over the years and more so recently increased my research. There is some cutting edge peptides becoming available and not at too of an unreasonable price. Some that come to mind are:

GnRH (Triptorelin)
GHRPs (2, 6, Ipa, etc.)
GHRH ( CJC - 1293, 1295, ser, etc.)
Follistatin
Myostatin Propeptide
IGF 1-DES 1,3

Anyway, I want to see what all of your interests are and we can expand/discuss/research each.

[BLUESTORM]

I like some good peptide talk.

Have you read up any one Activin receptor type-2B? Pretty damn interesting. Expensive as hell, but the research looks very promising. I've even seen some results on one person that forked out some serious coin for it. The only issue is the price.

Myo-029 is another really interesting one, but I also know someone(years ago) who payed BIG money on the real deal, and results were less than spectacular.

When it comes to anti myostatin inhibitors, you are really talking about a gamble when it comes to buying it. Few legit laboratories like Acceleron hold proof positive results on humans with their formulations. But saying you can get your hands on that is like saying you are holding the holy grail.

The biggest issue with the ones that sound the most promising are that fakes make their way all over the scene and you hear about lackluster results and it doesn't get the respect it deserves. I'm not saying sources that have these are knowingly selling fakes or anything. Hell, people could be using the wrong doses, not reconstituting them correctly or flat out be screwing their peptides up. But look at Des (1-3) Igf-1. It is supposed to be 10 times more potent that LR3IGF-1, and we just aren't seeing that.

Not trying to paint a bleek picture. Hell, I tried a huge majority of peptides out. I dove head in to peptides from the time IGF-1 started to get talked about. And I've learned a great deal in all these years.

[BD_554]

I like some good peptide talk.

Have you read up any one Activin receptor type-2B? Pretty damn interesting. Expensive as hell, but the research looks very promising. I've even seen some results on one person that forked out some serious coin for it. The only issue is the price.

Myo-029 is another really interesting one, but I also know someone(years ago) who payed BIG money on the real deal, and results were less than spectacular.

When it comes to anti myostatin inhibitors, you are really talking about a gamble when it comes to buying it. Few legit laboratories like Acceleron hold proof positive results on humans with their formulations. But saying you can get your hands on that is like saying you are holding the holy grail.

The biggest issue with the ones that sound the most promising are that fakes make their way all over the scene and you hear about lackluster results and it doesn't get the respect it deserves. I'm not saying sources that have these are knowingly selling fakes or anything. Hell, people could be using the wrong doses, not reconstituting them correctly or flat out be screwing their peptides up. But look at Des (1-3) Igf-1. It is supposed to be 10 times more potent that LR3IGF-1, and we just aren't seeing that.

Not trying to paint a bleek picture. Hell, I tried a huge majority of peptides out. I dove head in to peptides from the time IGF-1 started to get talked about. And I've learned a great deal in all these years.

You are all to right unfortunately, but on occassions we stumbble onto something that has some promise. Do any of these live up to the hype. I personally do not think so, but that is not to say they do not have their place in the BB and PL world. I like what I get from the GHRH/GHP combo. Especially, in terms of sleep quality at night. IGF-1 DES 1,3 is bendficial in that it provide the benefits of humalop/humalin with musch less to no risk. The follistatin and myopropeptides....who knows. I am currently researching these and will post up what my experience is. I have used the follistatin recently while cutting down via a keto style diet and well lets say the benefits were hard to hang just on the follistatin, but I preceive there was some.

[BLUESTORM]

Which Follistatin did you try out?

There definitely is some promise to many of these peptides. Though some of them may seem old news, I think we are still in a gray area with figuring out the correct dosing. And really, this is our trial and error process. Theres not a lot of data to go off. We are doing the science as well as being the guinea pig!

[BD_554]

Which Follistatin did you try out?

There definitely is some promise to many of these peptides. Though some of them may seem old news, I think we are still in a gray area with figuring out the correct dosing. And really, this is our trial and error process. Theres not a lot of data to go off. We are doing the science as well as being the guinea pig!

I have used the 344 at a dosage of 50mcg/day and 100mcg/day. Each were run for a period of 20 days, dose split into am/pm bilateral IM injections. The next run I am going to split the difference at ~75mcg and 10-20mcgs of Myostatin Propeptide to see what results I get. The protocol wil be the same as above with am/pm IM bilateral injects for 20 days. I just have to zero in on my dosage of the Myostatin Propeptide. The reports I am seeing says 25mcgs is too much and 10 mcgs is adequate. I am leaning toward trying the 20mcgs to see how I react and then if needed back off to the 10mcgs.

I can tell you some are reporting very convincing reports of added muscle tissue, but again the placebo effect if ever present. This is why I am trying a few things myself and doing my own research for new as well as existing data.

I am excited about what the future holds for us. This initial research is priceless and to think for our use we are pioneers. Obviously, there are risks and caution should be taken when trying this peptides with little to no data for human use.

[deadweight]

thanks for all this great info...im a total nood when it comes down to peptides but i would be the first to try them if i had em.....What u are doing here in this discussion is making a gate way to follow....please keep the info coming....u are writting the text book of the furture useing these drugs.....very interesting..carry on please...im paying attention....deadweight

[BLUESTORM]

Good choice. There are many different forms of Follistatin, and each has a specific trait, but as far as science shows, only follistatin-344 is active in muscle tissue.
Ohio State University has done some very interesting studies with Follistatin-344 on mice. They injected baby mice(don't remember age) with a single injection of various myostatin inhibiting genes, observed growth for two years, and the results on the follistatin-344 were mind blowing. Significantly larger muscle mass than any of the other and insanely larger than the control.
And even more amazing were the results of strength as they aged. All of the other mice got weaker nearing the end of their lifespan, but the follistatin-344 injected mice kept gaining strength.

And this was no gimmic for sales of any sort. It was research towards curing muscular dystrophy.

I have a new computer so I don't have the links anymore, but if you look up the study through OSU, it can easily be found.

[\SHINE/]

Good stuff and good thread people,


But using an inhibitor that gets your circulating Mysotatin down below 90% and you see fabled muscle gains…. You’ll have to keep supplementing with what ever you’re using to keep them for the long term?

I would like to give this stuff a run as well.

peace.

[BLUESTORM]

Good stuff and good thread people,


But using an inhibitor that gets your circulating Mysotatin down below 90% and you see fabled muscle gains…. You’ll have to keep supplementing with what ever you’re using to keep them for the long term?

I would like to give this stuff a run as well.

peace.

GH could possibly be the perfect key for therapy after your run of a myostatin inhibitor.

Effect of GH on tissue myostatin in GH-deficient adults

Myostatin mRNA expression was significantly inhibited to 31 ± 9% (P < 0.001) in response to GH administration (Fig. 3). In contrast, myostatin levels were not greatly affected after 6 months of treatment with placebo (79 ± 11%) as determined by quantitative real-time PCR normalized for the housekeeping GAPDH gene. Interestingly, the inhibitory effect of GH on myostatin was sustained during the course of GH administration. After 12 months of GH treatment, myostatin levels remained significantly depressed (37 ± 6%; P < 0.01), compared with baseline. In line with the impact of GH dose reduction on circulating IGF-I levels and body composition, the inhibitory effect on myostatin was sustained but slightly attenuated at 18 months (48 ± 5%; P < 0.01) of treatment...

...we demonstrate that GH effectively suppresses myostatin expression. Furthermore, we took advantage of a GH receptor (GHR) antagonist to demonstrate that attenuated GHR signaling results in significant up-regulation of myostatin. The data strongly implicate myostatin as an important target of GH action in skeletal muscle.

[\SHINE/]

As always good stuff!
I will say when I used PCT GH was always a big part of that which I feel helped to keep gains more than anything else. This study definitely points to one of the reasons why.

My normal GH dose is usualy 6-8 IU ed which is probably low for most, I wonder if that would be enuff to effectively keep M levels down? Any idea how much GH they used for that study?

Even if one can hold on to only 60 to 70% imo it would be worth a run.

Good stuff and good thread people,


But using an inhibitor that gets your circulating Mysotatin down below 90% and you see fabled muscle gains…. You’ll have to keep supplementing with what ever you’re using to keep them for the long term?

I would like to give this stuff a run as well.

peace.

GH could possibly be the perfect key for therapy after your run of a myostatin inhibitor.

Effect of GH on tissue myostatin in GH-deficient adults

Myostatin mRNA expression was significantly inhibited to 31 ± 9% (P < 0.001) in response to GH administration (Fig. 3). In contrast, myostatin levels were not greatly affected after 6 months of treatment with placebo (79 ± 11%) as determined by quantitative real-time PCR normalized for the housekeeping GAPDH gene. Interestingly, the inhibitory effect of GH on myostatin was sustained during the course of GH administration. After 12 months of GH treatment, myostatin levels remained significantly depressed (37 ± 6%; P < 0.01), compared with baseline. In line with the impact of GH dose reduction on circulating IGF-I levels and body composition, the inhibitory effect on myostatin was sustained but slightly attenuated at 18 months (48 ± 5%; P < 0.01) of treatment...

...we demonstrate that GH effectively suppresses myostatin expression. Furthermore, we took advantage of a GH receptor (GHR) antagonist to demonstrate that attenuated GHR signaling results in significant up-regulation of myostatin. The data strongly implicate myostatin as an important target of GH action in skeletal muscle.

[deadweight]

what peptide u think would work for like site injections?just curious...dw

[BD_554]

The results should be permanent as this does not shut down myostatin production it merely inhibits its activity. Think of it as nolv for your myostatin. I agree GH is a wonderful addition and personally I run two weeks on and two weeks off (actually I run IGF/MGF during this time). Keep in mind that there are some studies that indicate the inhibiting myostatin had an effect on connective tissue development/strength. This was in mice that lack the myostatin gene and it it thought that this was largely due to the the lack of myostatin during development/growth. Another issue I have been hearing is muscle strains when run for more than two weeks or at a dose of 200mcg or higher. Therefore, I will keep with the 2 on/2 off to be safe. This is a marathon not a sprint, but this will hopefully prove to be an edge for us.

[BLUESTORM]

Keep in mind that there are some studies that indicate the inhibiting myostatin had an effect on connective tissue development/strength. This was in mice that lack the myostatin gene and it it thought that this was largely due to the the lack of myostatin during development/growth. Another issue I have been hearing is muscle strains when run for more than two weeks or at a dose of 200mcg or higher. Therefore, I will keep with the 2 on/2 off to be safe. This is a marathon not a sprint, but this will hopefully prove to be an edge for us.

Yeah, from what I've come across on studies it seems the issues arise in mice that were altered at very young ages. In older mice, there is almost no negative trait from "therapy". But I do need to read up on the effects on 344 reducing serum creatine kinase levels.

[BLUESTORM]

what peptide u think would work for like site injections?just curious...dw

You mean for localized growth?
I would have to say a combination of MGF(Pegylated) and DES (1-3) IGF, or if you prefer IGF(LR3). But there is always debate because it will go systemic.
And as we have been talking about right here with the Follistatin-344, this is going to be the wave of the future. You can easily find the studies showing great localized growth, but this as well goes systemic.

We all know how stretching the fascial tissue is extremely important for this process(localized growth). There are specific exercises that can be done(DC training techniques) and maybe a good mix of using some of the things listed above in combination with a little SEO.

[BLUESTORM]

My normal GH dose is usualy 6-8 IU ed which is probably low for most, I wonder if that would be enuff to effectively keep M levels down? Any idea how much GH they used for that study?

5 µg/kg·night sc for 6 months. After completion of the placebo-controlled phase of the study, all patients received GH at an initial dose of 5 µg/kg·d for an additional 12 months of treatment.